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May Have flamboyant hook-up

Joined
Aug 15, 2005
Messages
410
i dont know how many i can get or how much they will be, i work at an lfs and my livestock manager said that they are showing up on his supplier list so i will have an answer for you on tuesday
 

cthulhu77

TONMO Supporter
Registered
Joined
Mar 15, 2003
Messages
6,638
Yep, its springtime again ! Remember, these are going to be adults, so have your tanks ready to go, and hopefully you can get some eggs before they die off...if you can establish a community, there would be quite a few members who would be interested in juveniles, I'm sure.

greg
 

Neogonodactylus

Haliphron Atlanticus
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Mar 17, 2003
Messages
662
What follows is very uncharacteristic of me and those of you you have seen my posts over the past few years will realize that while I have argued against the collection and sale of mimics, I've tried to keep a fairly even keel with regards to the industry. However, this thread pushed a button tonight that ignited some feelings that have been building in the back of my mind for some time. After writing this and rereading it, my first impulse was to hit delete. However, the more I think about it, the more concerned I am about the trend in the hobby to seek the rare and unusual, so I decided to go ahead and post my response. If flamboyants were sea horses and could be cultured with a sustainable market, I would not say a word, but they aren't, so here are my uncensored thoughts on this thread.

________________________________________________

Yes, they are cool with great postures and color change. I have certainly enjoyed stalking and photographing them in their native habitats. However, they are also rare and getting rarer. To my knowledge Metasepia pfefferi has not been cultured and M. tullbergi has only been reared with difficulty. Given that 99% of the animals shipped will not make it to adulthood, is it really worth the cost to this species to promote their collection and sale?

In fact, I think it is perhaps a good time for elements of the cephalopod aquarists community to take a look at a disturbing trend. There seems to be increasing pressure to acquire ever more exotic and rare species. With mimics and wonderpus going for up to $500 and flamboyants for over $100, a market is being created that local collectors and exporters cannot ignore. I strongly doubt that the populations of these animals can withstand this level of harvesting for very long. Perhaps it is time to ask why you need to have an exotic cephalopod in your tank for a few weeks when there is essentially no chance of rearing it and when dozens died so that one could make it to your retailer.

Now that I have started getting this off of my chest, let me go one step further. Much of the initial support for Tonmo came from people who were fascinated by cephalopods and wanted an opportunity to interact with them. The site did a great service introducing these animals to people and educating them on how to maintain them. Do at least in part to sources of information such as Tonmo, we even go to the point where commercial ventures were launched trying to provide captive reared animals for enthusiasts. Well, we have all seen how successful that was. Unfortunately, when it was easy and less cool to have your own bimac, at least part of the market quickly dried up and moved on to more exotic species, so we are back to the days of "Hey, Bud, want to buy a flamboyant? They are really rare and hard to get."

Roy
 

a rabid squid

GPO
Registered
Joined
Oct 6, 2004
Messages
159
the point of getting them is to breed them and relive the stress on the natural population. you should try to sell them to people with intent to breed them and the people who just want one can get the next generation. they could save a lot of money by getting a tank bred one. i for one would love to breed them and see if you can get some to righty.
 

Colin

TONMO Supporter
Registered
Joined
Nov 14, 2002
Messages
3,985
Since the very beginning of the cephalopod husbandry area of this site, it has been a high priority to emphasise the importance of captive breeding and we have always encouraged people to have a go if possible and if not, then to at least buy captive bred stock.

This has however, mostly been in reference to Octopus bimaculoides, a non-threatened octopus from the USA.

I have lost count of how many posts I have submitted trying to dissuade people from buying a cephalopod on impulse and from others buying species such as Mimic, Wunderpus, Blue rings and of course, Metasepia flamboyant cuttlefish.

Nothing has changed.

I currently work in conservation and I have also worked in the exotic animal trade for many years. It gives me a fairly unique view, and as i have said before; we should not encourage the collection of animals like this.

I am 100% with Roy on this one.

Metasepia are not the way forward as a captive cephalopod breeding programme. There is a LOT more ground work that has to be done before anyone could justify buying in several specimens for a breeding project.

The presence of a market does not justify the animal as candidates for a breeding project.

I don't think we have gotten to the bottom of what happened with OctoPets but they are not the only example of cephalopod breeding businesses that have gone bust pretty quick. CephSource anyone?

Yes, it would be nice to get some and have them breed so that CB specimens could be sold but these are certainly not an easy subject and remember, even Sepia bandensis has only been taken past F1 generation a couple of times. It doesnt take much to lose an entire batch!

In closing, this is a specialist group of marine invertebrate and as a special interest group we should not be part of the problem that these cephalopods face from the ornamental aquatic hobby.

Colin
 

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