tankmates

[TidePool Geek]

Mystic January wrote:
it seems everything i want wont go with anything else.

Hi MJ,

I'm afraid that's exactly the case; in fact, it may be a complete
understatement!

First off - Tank size: You're limited, as Nancy said, to only the
smallest species such as O. mercatoris. The problem there is that, at
present, these are only available as wild by-catch specimens. As such,
you'd be getting an animal of indeterminate age that has probably
already lived out most of its very short lifespan. [I can't find a
reference but I'm pretty sure its lifespan is 1 year or less.]

Next - Octopus with Seahorse: Compatibility with an octopus isn't a
matter of territory or dominance. Octos are predators and very hungry
ones at that. An octo sees everything in his world in terms of whether
or not he can kill and eat it. Since seahorses are such weak swimmers
they would be easy prey for even a small octo. I don't know too much
about seahorses but if their only defenses are thick skin and
camouflage an octo wouldn't even be slowed down by them. OTOH: If
seahorses happen to have some sort of chemical defense (which seems
unlikely) like a bad taste or toxic slime, there's a good chance that
the octo will have killed it in the process of learning about the
defense.

Then - Octopus with Clownfish: Clowns depend on a host anemone for
defense. Without such a host the clown will be dinner. Further, I
think it's fair to say that a clown without a host will be stressed
even if there aren't any predators to threaten him. Here's a link to
some additional info about the clownfish you mentioned:
http://animaldiversity.ummz.umich.edu/site/accounts/information/Amphiprion_ocellaris.html
So, if you want a clown you should also have a suitable host anemone.
Now you've got an illumination problem. Most, if not all, host
anemones utilize symbiotic algae to provide some (but not all) of
their nutrition. Because of that they need a lot of light and most
octos don't like that at all. If your aquarium has enough light to
keep the anemone happy your octo will probably stay hidden most of the
time. Another problem has to do with space. An anemone that's large
enough to be a suitable host will take up a significant percentage of
the available real estate in your tank which will limit the octo's
freedom of movement. [BTW: I'm probably the only one on this forum
that thinks anemones and octos can be kept together at all but that's
only with quite a large tank.]

Finally - Octopus with Sea Star: With a couple of exceptions octos and
stars shouldn't bother each other. BUT there's some question about
whether a star should be kept in a home aquarium at all. Tropical
stars are simply not very well understood in terms of diet and other
requirements and they often die in a fairly short period. Before
getting a star you should determine which species are of interest and
then do some pretty serious research about their requirements before
you buy. DO NOT take the advice of your LFS at face value! Much of the
info. found in the trade is little more than hearsay. Here are some
links to Ron Shimek's articles about sea stars; the first two deal
with keeping them in a home tank while the second two are mainly
background information:
http://web.archive.org/web/20020804172027/www.animalnetwork.com/fish2/aqfm/1998/april/wb/default.asp
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-12/rs/index.php

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-10/rs/index.php
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-11/rs/index.php

Compatibly yours,

Alex

 

[mystic_january]

hey thanks guys i really appreciate all the info you have given me to think about, and thanks uhh OCTO OAKLEY for finally easing my mind about that brown stuff. i think im going to try with maybe a couple seahorses and a starfish.. well the starfish will come in after i get some algaie. but if the seahorses don't work out im definately going to look into geting an octopus. it would be nice if they could all just get along and not eat each other, or steal each others food. but oh well. if anyone has experiance with seahorses, please dont be shy to give me some pointers. i am completely new at salt water aquariums, 2 weeks ago i didnt even know how to make the water salty. lol dont get me wrong, I have done research but theres only so much you can learn from textbooks. thanks guys im really bummed that i cant get an octo, at least with my seahorses.

but yea if anyone has sudgestions on what kinds of seahorses are good, where to get them, how to feed them etc etc etc let me know

 

[mystic_january]

wow i didnt even see page 2 till now thanks alex for the essay you posted :P i really dont want to take anything that has been living in the vast ocean and confining it to my 29 gallon fish tank i think thats just horrible. as for the clownfish and seahorses i dont think im going to try the two together either, like u said the clownfish dont feel safe without a big annenomie..

 

[OCTO OAKLEY]

HEY MJ I HAVE KEPT SEAHORSES BEFORE AND HAVE HAD SUSCESS WITH THEM AND I FOUND THAT THERE PRETTY EASY IF YA KNO WHAT YOUR DOING REALLY THA MAIN THING IS FEEDING THEM AND WATER CONDITIONS THA FOOD THEY NEED MUST BE REALLY SMALL I RECOMEND MYSIS SHRIMP! AND YOU PROBABLLY ALREADY KNOW THA IDEAL TANK CONDITIONS RITE? WELL IF NOT I GOT THEM RITE HERE THE TEMPATURE SHOULD BE 72-78°F THE SPECIFIC GRAVITY SHOULD BE 1.020-1.025 pH 8.1-8.4! AND IT WOULD PROBABLLY MAKE IT EASIER IF YOU CAN FIND A TANK BRED ONE THEY ARE ALREADY ACCUSTOMED TO THA MYSIS SHRIMP! AND YOUS SHOULD PROBABLLY GET SOME SEAGRASS OR KELP FOR THEM TO CLING ON TO. OH YEAH AND YOU COULD ALWAYS KEEP A PIPEFISH WITH THEM OR SOME SMALL GOBIES, FIREFISH AND MAYBE A PERCULA CLOWN BUT THOS ARE A USE WITH CAUTION TYPE OF DEAL BUT I DO KNOW PIPEFISH WILL BE PERFECTLY OKAY! WELL I HOPE THIS HELPS IF YA HAVE ANY QUESTIONS JUST ASK!

 

[DHyslop]

Pretty much nothing goes with seahorses. Like octos, they prefer a species tank. A tank for either has to be set up with special considerations: seahorses like very little flow and prefer tall tanks where they can move up and down quite a bit. People often use 30-40 gallon hex tanks for them. Seahorses also have a very simple digestive system that isn't effective at storing food, meaning they should be fed multiple times per day. Even if you get captive bred horses there's no guarantee they'll take frozen food, so you should be raising rotifers and things for them to eat in another tank.

To be honest, I probably would recommend clownfish to you. A captive bred false percula has typically never seen an anemone in its life--many a reefer has put anemones in their tanks just to be snubbed by their clowns. Sometimes it takes months or years for a CB clownfish to start hosting, and it often involves a little sleight of hand: right now I have a photo of an anemone taped to the side of the tank to get them used to the idea of having one. If they still dislike it in a few weeks, I will replace it with a photograph of the same anemone with a clown in it.

If I were you I'd let the tank cycle for another month or so and get two very young clowns one a little bit bigger than the other. If you ever do want to get an anemone, there's a few things to consider. If you get false perculas (Amphiprion ocellaris), there's no anemone they naturally host in that will fit in your tank. About the only anemone for you is the bubble-tip anemone. False percs can sometimes be convinced or tricked into hosting these, but no guarantees. There are other species of clowns that do naturally host BTAs, but they will cost you a bit more. I think false percs are the prettiest, but many people at reefcentral.com would scoff at that

Also, every anemone needs more light than the flourescent light on your tank can provide. That light is fine for the clowns, but you would need to buy some power compacts for a BTA. Anemones usually like to have a bit of current through the tank. Remember these are not sessile creatures, and if you put it where it looks pretty in the tank, it will move to where it feels happy

Go to www.reefcentral.com and look in their forums. They have a whole message board dedicated to clownfish and anemones. They also have an area for seahorses if you want to learn some more about those. There's enough reading material there to keep you busy for a few weeks

Dan

 

[lockburn]

Seahorses do indeed prefer species tanks. I have two identical tanks, one for a group of seahorses, the other for my octo, plumbed together via a sump. Unfortunately that leaves me no place to keep other fish. I think I'll need to add a third tank to keep clowns, butterflys, etc.

 

[Mermaid]

I think sticking to seahorses is a good idea for the moment, then in the future you can consider getting another larger tank to keep your octopus.
And yes you can keep seahorses with some fish (i wouldn't recommend clown fish either...too aggressive) as long as they won't bother the seahorses or are to quick and will steal all of the food, leaving the seahorses to starve...remember seahorses are very slow. A good tankmate for that size aqurium is a green/blue manderin fish or something similar.