Could a large squid kill a sperm whale?

[ArchieFan]

I would have to agree with cthulhu77 on the "big fish stories" If giant squid were threatening ships, there would be a lot more forensic evidence to support that. I got a cat that gets nervous around a mouse, but that doesn't mean that a mouse might be capable of killing a cat. Giant squid are a known prey species of whales by the beaks they find in their stomachs. That forensic evidence should be a good indication of the actual maximum size of Archies. I guess it is possible that the archies might outgrow predators as large as sperm whales though. I just have a hard time believing that they could get so large that they could actually be a serious threat to a sperm whale. Besides nothing has ever washed up on shore, or caught in a net, large enough to be a serious threat to a sperm whale. My opinion on that sceanario it is just fanciful imagination. A lot of prey species can give their predators a run for their money, but that doesn't mean it's a serious threat.

 

[ScottDV]

I half-way agree, when someone imbibes too much it isn't known as "drinking like a sailor" for nothing. However, I would be careful in too easily dismissing sailors accounts of giant squids just because they are too big than what is considered 'acceptable range' to modern day marine biologists. Keep in mind the very idea of a giant squid just 150 years ago was scoffed at by scientists and anyone who claimed to have seen one bigger than several feet long was dubbed a drunken fool. So when it comes to the existence of giant squids from the start they were always a mythological creature proven to actually exists so its sailors 1 and scientists 0 in this game of tall tales and legends. We don't know enough about them to give an accurate size range, a couple dozen dead bodies floating ashore over the past 100 years out of presumably millions of RL giant squids is not a sufficient sampling to give a real size range for an animal, only a guesstimate that could be accurate or very wrong.

 

[ScottDV]

That would have to be one big squid to kill a sperm whale. Oh, where did you find that account of a right whale being killed by squid? In my eleven years of studying giant squid, I have never come across that story.

-Squidman-

Yes indeed, but if the question were changed to 'Has a Giant squid EVER killed a Sperm Whale" I would bet my life it has happened at some point in the history of this world.

The report of a giant squid killing a Wright Whale is something new to me as of yesterday (just before i found this website). I have never read it in a book before but did read a reference of it off the internet. The right Whale gets almost as big as the Sperm Whale topping out at 60 feet which is about the max of the Sperm Whale too. But in this case it was a baby Wright Whale, but even a baby Wright Whale is pretty big at most likely 9 to 15 feet long or so which is approx. the size of most Great White sharks so we have our answer to what would happen if those two ever met in combat. Now the squid supposedly drowned the Whale and since a whale is a mammal it needs air unlike a fish. However, sharks need to move to keep breathing so all a squid would have to do is grab it and hold it in a vice like grip until the fishie (shark) dies. This is probably a very boring death and counter to the Gotterdammerung battle most people here would imaging them having.

Anyway, back to the topic this is the quote I read:

In October 1966 two lighthouse keepers at Danger Point, South Africa watched a giant squid drown a baby southern right whale.

from here. http://www.pibburns.com/cryptost/kraken.htm

So killing Wright Whales for nothing but sport is an obvious exaggeration, if this happened there is no reason to believe it was other than a random and isolated event until proven otherwise (and if it did it could have done so for food not sport). For accounts like these without much supporting documentation and verification I put it in the category of 'Might be true" and not the Gospel truth. I don’t immediately dismiss them as drunken tales either though because you would be surprised how these sometimes turn out to be dead on. When it comes to these Tall Tales of Monster squids its best to classify them in three categories of True, Maybe true, and utter bullshit IMHO.

 

[ScottDV]

I agree with that insofar that a Giant Squid vs Sperm Whale battle is kind of like a He said She said story and we would only get one side of it since the Whale needs to surface to breath if it get's locked in combat therefore if it does surface it successfully is beating the squid and will win thus we can see it but if the squid wins it will STAY down at 20,000 feet plus where mankind will never see the squid emerge as the victor because the evidence says down in the deep inky depths along with the victorious squid. So who knows, I doubt they win often but they probably have before (especially if two work together against one Sperm Whale).

 

[ScottDV]

I would have to agree with cthulhu77 on the "big fish stories" If giant squid were threatening ships, there would be a lot more forensic evidence to support that.

Keep in mind in the story of the Schooner Pearl sunk by a Giant Squid it did not attack the ship until after the captain saw it floating on the surface of the water and despite the warning of an old sea hand from Newfoundland provoked it by shooting it with a rifle.

 

[ScottDV]

Hello Brennan,


Never heard that one. If something like that happened, I think it's significant that this scene was observed from a Soviet whaler. Perhaps they recovered a harpooned sperm whale that vomited up a large squid in its death throes, or killed a whale after it had surfaced with its dinner.

Clem

Here is the story:

1965. Crew of the Soviet whaler Mirny- Giant squid attacks 40 ton sperm whale, neither survive. The whale is strangled, the squid's head is bitten off.

from http://scienceblogs.com/deepseanews/2007/10/attacks_of_the_kraken.php


We have a date and a name of the ship now. For someone who is a man of means with time and money to spare, which I have little of (especially the latter) one could probably pull the crew manifests and track down the ship and then all the sailors who served on it for that year and ask them if this story is true and if they actually saw that or if it is an invented internet hoax making the rounds.

The name of the vessel was

 

[ScottDV]

Even if the average squid is much smaller and always gets eaten by Sperm Whales when they fight and that most likely is the case from what evidence we have seen over the years so far. There is a reason I am confident that a giant squid has killed a sperm whale in battle before at some point. I know most of the people here are squid and octopi enthusiasts and probably don't care much about mammals. However, let's say hypothetically a thread was started here saying "Could a coyote kill a human?" I bet most of you would say other than perhaps a small child the answer was a resounding 'NO!'

The posters here would say that was a preposterous questions and rightfully point out that:
1.) Coyotes are small, from 15 to 35 pounds on average
2.) Coyotes are shy and not aggressive around humans
3.) Coyotes prefer to hunt alone unlike their larger more viscous cousins the wolf that hunts in packs.
4.) Coyotes prefer smaller game that are easier to kill and eat like rabbits, squirrels, dogs, and cats.

Yet...

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/toronto-singer-killed-by-coyotes/article1341376/

Strange things happen from time to time...

 

[OB]

A sperm whale could die from a squid counterattack if by chance the entire squid, or its tentacle club would cover its blowhole and stay there. The force of an exhaling sperm whale's breath is, however, not a trifle matter, so I wonder if sucker rings and vacuum would suffice to pull it off, reverse pun intended.

PS: what on earth makes you think we don't care about mammals? We love them
PPS: Had you started your coyote thread, my answer would have been a resounding "yes!", by the way, coyote borne rabies kills humans easily.

 

[DWhatley]

I suspect the majority of answers would be yes considering that a domestic dog can kill a human . MY dogs wouldn't of course, but trying to convince a neighbor that a 130+ dog who's head allows it to reach your dinner plate without stretching and who has huge teeth is not aggressive is somewhat difficult. I would say humans in general would answer yes to almost any animal with teeth. As a lot, we are pretty whimpy and don't do a lot of research. You would be surprised at how many people think an octopus is dangerous and not because of its poison. The tales and imagination about the sea scares most people and they will believe almost anything about that unknown without question.

 

[ScottDV]

Ok, yeah I wasn't counting killing people based off of illness or disease though but good point nonetheless.

I understand what people here and other cephalopod experts try to do with educating the masses ignorant of animals and their behavior. I think the torrid imaginations of tales of Giant Squids sinking boats and plucking sailors off ships to eat them is just as ridiculous as you all do. however, I do look at both sides and when an expert gives a conclusive solid "no" answer to say that has NEVER happened before or squids NEVER get above a certain size then that's when i have an issue with is because only God and one other would know (assuming they exist).

One thing I have noticed too and it might be human nature is usually when biologists work with animals with a fierce unfounded reputation they sometimes go to far to the other side and start to become reckless or careless thinking reports of attacks are ALL unfounded and refute them. When this happens they open themselves up to a rude awakening when the animal does read the darker side of its nature. Think of Timothy Treadwell who proved most bears are not the man-eating machines that popular culture imagines them to be. Until he ran into one bad individual that basically was. Like humans animals (as any pet owner can attest to) have individual personalities and dispositions of their own and some are just bad apples. imagine running into a giant squid with the personality of a serial killer? lol

Anyway, another example of a animal with a really bad rep. is Timber Wolves, very undeserved in many ways at least as it relates to interaction (ie attacks) on humans.

Then we get experts who go too far the other direction and proclaim wolves NEVER attack humans...Now over the past 5 years we have had 2 people in North America alone that were torn apart by a pack of wolves in unprovoked attacks.

Wolves kill teacher in Alaska
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2005/11/10/wolf051110.html

 

[DWhatley]

I wish the animal specials would strongly make this point and show animals in both modes. Any animal, especially a hungry one, can be sited to attack abnormally and well satiated (or at least full) animals will often ignore normal prey. When extremes occur it is likely a sign something is wrong in the environment and perhaps we should be looking there rather than trying to expose specific behaviors.

 

[Damien]

a fully adult sperm whale is clearly stronger than a giant or colossal squid ( if we considered actually known maximum size of such squid)...even considering the biggest beaks found.

but with humor i could post it : "who knows ..."
strip 138:Cthulhoo Kebab

strip 14:Deep explorer

strip 13:Giants of the depths